Send Midi signal from VDMX to another computer's VDMX

Questions
1

I have a big project coming up for Australian Open where I want two computers to be doing the same thing synced in case one computer dies. So basically one midi controller controlling two computers with the exact same VDMX project, doing everything in sync, but only one computer is outputted to the IMAG Screen. This is to ensure that if one computer dies, I can quickly switch and change the input source of the IMAG Screen to the other computer.

I have all the inputs/outputs with switchers worked out, the only part I’m trying to work out is having one midi controller control two computers with the same VDMX projects at the same time.

I originally wanted to have my midi controller going into a midi interface which would duplicate the signal to two controllers, but then I realised I’m using an APC40 MK2, which doesn’t even have a midi output, so my second option I can think of now, is to have the midi controller connected to the main computer, and having that computer duplicate midi signals to another computer through network.

I have the network part worked out too, the only problem I have now is how I can send the midi signals from VDMX. I understand with each midi input into VDMX, I can choose where to send it to through the UI inspector, but this requires me to do this on EVERY midi input I setup in VDMX, which can be quite dangerous as it is possible that I might miss one output setting to the other computer.

My main question is, is there a way to do this setting once, and all future midi input setups I do will automatically send to the other computer’s VDMX? If not doable through VDMX, are there any third party apps that can do what I want? Or is there an even easy way of doing this that I have not thought of?

Thanks in advance.

UPDATE:
I just realised this update I thought of is quite stupid because if the main comptuer dies, it can’t send midi signals to the other computer anyways LOL! But I would still like to know if it’s possible to do something like this in case I have other uses, and also if it’s possible to connect APC40 MK2 to a midi interface that can have signals split into two computers.

2

I have a few ideas how you could achieve something like this. The simplest is to just copy paste the project to another computer and then unplug and plug again in the other machine. But this means that you would be at a different point when switching.

Another option is to use a third machine and maybe use VUO to get the MIDI inputs and then send those out. Either as MIDI or OSC.

3

You should be able to use Osculator or another MIDI routing program to send the same commands to two separate machines (locally, and over network). OSC is going to be a more network friendly protocol. Additionally, you would want to hook up your computers to a mixer or switcher of some kind.

For example, if computer 1 dies, you can switch over to computer 2 and plug in your midi controller directly to the second machine. If you have the same VDMX project on both machines, they could be listening for both OSC commands and MIDI commands for the same buttons and sliders. If computer 1 dies (and Osculator with it), then the APC will need to be manually moved, but if VDMX dies, and Osculator does, you can continue to use computer 1 and the controller, to work with the 2nd VDMX machine while you restart the VDMX application on the first machine.

If you use TouchOSC instead of the APC, you should also be able to do this.

https://osculator.net/ (is discontinued, but should still work)

Alternatives (I don’t have any experience with):

Also found this if you want to use a windows machine to be your master “controller”
https://github.com/matt-dale/MIDI_TO_OSC

4

@saolun

Here’s what Bome said (copy/paste)

At this time, Bome Network does not do any OSC.
In the scenario you’ve described, it would work like this:

Given are:

  • remote computer B with attached APC MIDI controller
  • local computer A.
  • I assume that computer A is running VDMX

How to use the APC on computer A:

  • Install Bome Network on both computers. Purchase one Pro add-on license and unlock on both computers.
  • In Bome Network, use the connect button to establish the MIDI link between computers A and B
  • now the APC appears as a (virtual) MIDI device on computer A
  • this virtual MIDI device can be used in VDMX as if it was plugged into computer A

So unless I’m missing something, you don’t need OSC in this scenario.

5

You could also get one of the iconnect boxes that allow you have a incoming midi source go to 2 laptops.

It also allows incoming timecode/audio to go to both machines at same time as well. Works really well for this exact situation and ha become a popular way to have back up machines running in sync.

2 Likes
6

Awesome, that’s good to know. Looks like Bome also has something similar: BomeBox – Bome Software

I wonder how they compare?

7

Hello! I’m doing also this (anxiety overload backup system), in multiple ways, on multiple systems for multiple screens backing up each other and trying to avoid single point of failure. There are many ways of doing it, and I keep trying to figure out most elegant (and fast setup) solutions, I suppose we all have our own needs and ways… Good suggestions in this thread, I’m adding how I’m currently doing it. This is not exact answer to your questions but perhaps some of this info can help you figure out a solution that works for you:

OPTION 1

Master control computer running Ableton Live 12, sending the MIDI to multiple computers. MIDI is output with ESI M4U EX MIDI interface. Both the live input MIDI (me performing live) and sequenced MIDI (programmed) are duplicated live in Ableton Live and routed out simultaneously to different ports.

These MIDI signals are then sent to each VDMX system (separate computers), where the MIDI is received by a VOLT 2 Audio interface, where I can also duplicate the AUDIO that is used for audio analysis effects. (So audio is routed from Volt to Volt to Volt…). This way I always have two VDMX systems duplicated for instant switchover.

For further backup in case the brain / audio system goes down, I have then a fourth computer that has pre-rendered audio and pre-rendered visuals. When possible, this runs in sync with the main computer, so if the BRAIN computer or something else critical goes down, I can swap over to this “dumb playback” computer so at least there is media (audio/video) going out while I either fix or restart the problem thing. Worst case it is unsynced and I have to locate the exact position for continued play, which means a dropout of 10-15 sec.

All these systems go into ATEM Mini so the switch over is mostly un-noticable to the audience.

I do NOT trust wireless / network MIDI so I always run signals in cables.

(The “dumb” computer has actually turned out to be a brilliant solution for me, because it means I can swap over to the dumb computer while I load new VDMX projects so I’m running “pre-rendered” visuals while loading. So there is no apparant visual downtime to the audience.)

HOWEVER. This costs four computers (brain, vdmx 1, vdmx 2, dumb, plus switcher, and it’s a lot to travel with, and takes time to set up. But it has triple redundancy for visuals.

In my experience VDMX visuals crash maybe every 2-3 shows. Ableton audio crashes once every 5-6 years. But even if no crashes or app issues, macOS itself sometimes does insane things (remember the phone-home–on-open-apps catastrophe a few years ago? All apps took hours to open because macOS certificate servers were down. Always have one computer NOT on a network!!)

OPTION 2

A very simple oldskool solution that I used earlier: MIDI Interfaces with MIDI THRU. It seems the THRU port is being forgotten by both users and makers, it is rare to find it these days, but it used to be on all MIDI Interfaces. That port simply forwards what comes in on the IN port, so you can daisy-chain MIDI Interfaces. That is a dead simple way of duplicating MIDI signals to multiple devices, if you can do the MIDI signals on a dedicated computer.

I used the iRig MIDI 2, a no-frills dead simple little box that provides MIDI THRU.

OPTION 3

If you only have two computers doing this, and only the “main” computer gets your MIDI Input, and if it is powerful enough, I would run Ableton Live and simply duplicate everything that comes in on a second hardware MIDI device, going into the backup computer. But as you note, if the main computer goes down here, you’re screwed.

Good luck with the gig!!

8

Would this work with my APC40 MK2? The problem with the APC40 is that it does not have a midi output, only a usb output that drives both power and data, so I’m not sure if it will be plug and play with midi interfaces with usb ports.

9

So I found the CME H4MIDI WC (CME H4MIDI WC: USB Host MIDI Interface + Router, Filter, Mapper) which apparently can take in usb midi devices, which is perfect for my APC40 MK2. I just ordered one on Amazon, and if this works, then my setup will be pretty easy, and will not need any networks. It would essentially be the following setup:

  1. APC40 MK2 connected to the CME H4MIDI WC through usb, with two midi outs into Laptop A (Main) and Laptop B. This will ensure one Midi Controller sends signals to both Laptops at the same time.

  2. Laptop A and Laptop B will be running the exact same VDMX project, both receiving same midi inputs for running the show. Both Laptops will be connected to a BlackMagic Atem 4K8 Switcher, which then Outputs onto the IMAG Screen for the audiences.

  3. If Laptop A dies, I use the Blackmagic switcher to quickly switch to Laptop B, which should be seamless and not really noticable by the audience. And that should be the only thing I need to do, I shouldn’t need to unplug or plug in any extra midi controllers.

Hope this option can work. If anyone spots any bugs in my setup, please do let me know.

10

So with this setup, you’ll also need two 5 pin midi to USB converters as well? Thanks

11

Yes, I already have plenty of those lying around. Once my midi interface arrives tomorrow, and I have time to play around with the setup, I’ll let you guys know how it goes.

2 Likes
12

Just a quick update to the setup I mentioned before using the H4MIDI WC (Send Midi signal from VDMX to another computer's VDMX - #9 by saolun)

Happy to report that everything worked like a charm with no extra setup required. I plugged in my APC40 into the midi usb input on the H4MIDI WC, had two midi outs from the interface, one to laptop A, another to laptop B, and just like that, both laptops were receiving signals from the APC40. I tried it with a basic VDMX project, and everything just works. Yay!

3 Likes
13

Thanks for sharing your setup here. Good Luck with the show.

I have tried using 2x MBP a few times.

  1. VJ Mixer - Roland
    2)AV Switcher - Roland

with 1x MBP + GPU (BlackMagic)

I preferred all in one computer or laptop due to the fact that I have no time to switch between 2 laptops unless you are doing a show caller with prepared material with clips and content on cue, then you just programme your laptops to automate timecode to cue for the show.

you’re setup looks like is a VJ setup for VJing. Have you thought about why you need a backup laptop? Usually I think is your GPU isn’t fast enough.

MDFBWY

14

For what I’m doing, which is literally just cue playbacks of videos/images/ppt/music after cue playbacks, no real VJing is actually involved, my M1 Max GPU is more than enough. I’m only having two laptops because you never know with these things what could go wrong, just good to know that I have a backup that can be used instantly if anything were to go wrong with the first Laptop. The events I do is mainly corporate/keynote events etc. so tolerance to error on the visual side is literally 0, hence why I’m obsessed with having backups.

15

On the topic of “if anything should go wrong”, now that I think of it, I think hardware wise it’s been very stable, havn’t had hardware issues during shows yet, only during bump in. All hiccups during shows that have happened in the past have always been due to software issues. I’m gonna add pressure to the VDMX team hahaha.